Antigone Episode #1 - Drama, death, higher law, family issues and more death - a podcast by Christy and Garry Shriver

Antigone Episode #1 - Drama, death, higher law, family issues and more death

 

2Hi, I’m Christy Shriver.

 

And I’m Garry Shriver and this is the how to love lit podcast.  We are working our way through Sophocles’ greatest hits!!  Of all the plays he wrote, as we discussed last week, we only have seven (which I guess isn’t that surprising since they were written in the 400’s bc)- but of those his Oedipus trilogy is by far the most popular- and of those three- Oedipus Rex is the most popular of those.

 

I’m excited to talk about his second most popular, Antigone, which is actually the first one he wrote- mostly because it’s about a brave woman- which is super surprising.  You don’t expect to see strong females in a lot of classical literature written by men and especially literature from the ancient- in fact, off the top of my head, I can’t think of another one, although maybe there is- in most stories a woman hero is a woman who is self-sacrificing, like Hecaba,  but she’s not really a strong protagonist- and really this should be surprising- in the ancient world  women were literally property- they were viewed legally as such and they viewed themselves as such- which actually comes out in this play.  But, Antigone, the character- does NOT consider herself property- good for her and good for Sophocles for creating this character- although I think most scholars will tell you that like the story of Oedipus he is retelling a well-known story and there’s a couple of different versions floating around some are quite complicated and have her running away and all kinds of things- but I think she hangs herself in all of them.   

 

Well,  The Oedipus/ antigone story, as you know from the last three podcasts, really starts with Oedipus’ birth to his parents Jocasta and Laius.- and we probably have should have mentioned this too- even though the whole I married my mom problem is a real thing- don’t let the age gap confuse you.  In the ancient world, old men often married really young girls- so it was probably true that Laius and Jocasta were farther apart in age than Oedipus and Jocasta- but age not withstanding- neither Oedipus nor Jocasta take it will well when they realize what he has done in marrying his mother and murdering his father.    Jocasta kills herself first because she figures it out first, and When Oedipus Rex  figures out what happened and in an outburst of unrestrained rage, grief, agony,  and what other array of emotions one would feel upon such a revelation, he gets Jocasta’s dress pins and dramatically, passionately and  pokes his eyes out leaving quite literally a bloody mess.  At the end of that play, after this revelation, Oedipus makes a deal with Creon which actually will be the impetus for this play.  He is going to promise never to come back to Thebes if Creon will take care of his children,.  He’s not worried about his sons, but he’s particularly worried about Ismene and Antigone- again them being  tainted goods at this point.  Creon agrees and is left as Regent or surrogate ruler of Thebes until the boys are old enough to rule

 

I didn’t really think about this when we ended the play, but I guess I should have.  I just assumed that Creon would be king since that’s where we end it.  But obviously, that’s not the case.  The crown goes to oedipus’ two sons- Polyneices and Eteoclyes. 

 

Well, they are too young to rule at first, but Creon, it appears, brokers this deal that there were two of them that they would take turns a year at a time- one would rule for a year and then would switch out and the other would rule for a year and so forth and Eteocles would go first.

 

Let me just interject, that every mother in the room knows that deal is not going to work.  It doesn’t even work with toys.  Have you ever done the move where one kid is going to get the cellphone to play games for two minutes and after two minutes you’re going to switch out?  That plan always has the same outcome- crying.

 

And that’s about how it worked out in this case.  The elder brother Eteocles refuses to resign the kingship to Polyneices at the end of the first year of the Royal Condominium. A civil war breaks out, with Polyneices trying to recruit an army from Argos.

 

 

That actually is a story in a totally other play by Aschyles, but it does get us into the SECOND play of the Oedipus series, Oedipus at Colonnus that Sophocles probably didn’t even write until he was in his late 80s or maybe even 90s. it wasn’t even performed until after his death.  Some think its his most reflective of the three, but I won’t speak to that.  I think they are all just so very different in what they are going for.  Antigone being the most political and Colonnus being the most personally reflective, if you want to think of it like that.  Anyway, back to the story- in this play, the one we’re NOT reading.  All these years, howevery many there were, Oedipus has been wandering aimlessly around Greece.  He comes to this town called Colunus, ironically where Sophocles is actually from, and the king there a guy named King Theseus gives him hospitality.  Antigone, when she is old enough to be out on her own, actually goes there and takes care of her aging father. 

 

Meanwhile…as they say…back in the war…there is yet another prophecy- these dang prophecies.  Apollo reveals that whoever possesses the person of Oedipus is fated to win the war at Thebes.  So now, the two sons, who didn’t get a rats booty about their dad suddenly are in a hunt to kidnap him.  Ismene is going to show up in Colonnus to tell Antigone and Oedipus what is happening.  She also mentions that word is that the city where Oedipus dies is going to have good luck, so they may be coming for him. Creon, who is on team Eteocles goes to Colonus to try to kidnap Oedipus.  King Theseus, however, is protecting Oedipus, and puts an end of that- but Creon, so as not to go away empty-handed, kidnaps Ismene and Antigone.  King Theseus goes and gets the girls.  But at this point Oedipus, angry that his sons for being so self-involved and callous, because if you think about it- look how many people are dying over this- never mind the personal injury to himself and their sisters- he curses them.  Polyneices who had come to Colonus too to get Oedipus’ support sees his plan was probably a fail, understands that this curse he just got from his father may be a big deal and asks his sisters to be sure to bury him.  Thunder and lightening happen, Oedipus has his last moment on earth- the only one with him at his death is Theseus- and that is by design- so that the location of his death will be a total secret- because remember there’s that promise of luck…and hence the end of Oedipus…but maybe not- it seems the gods find him worthy because of all the suffering he has endured and make him a god- ultimate irony- and back to the last line and moral lesson of Oedipus- you never know if you had a good life until the very very end.  

 

Wow- what a life.  Poor guy!  Anyway, after his passing, Antigone goes back to Thebes, presumably to stop the madness between the brothers…to avail… they go and kill each other in battle…and this is where our play today begins.  Now remember, its still a Greek play with all the conventions of Greek plays that we discussed in episode one.  There are still in an amphitheater.  They are still wearing masks.  There will never be more than three people on the stage at the same time, and of course, our favorite- the musical interludes.  We will be blessed every so often with an interruption of the plot with the musical interludes. 

 

So, we shall start with the prologue- and in this prologue we will meet the two sisters, Oedipus’ daughters, and they are set up at the very beginning to be foils.  Foils are two characters that contrast with each other and the contrast is supposed to be very obvious.  We see this a lot in Shakespeare- if you remember in Julius Caesar, Brutus and Anthony were foils.  Brutus was a partyer, an athelete, very popular and kind of a dumb jock- at least at that was his reputation.  Brutus was a nerd, bookish, didn’t like sports, but theoretically an eloquent orator.  Well we are going to see this in this play- Antigone is brave, head strong and an independent thinker.  Ismene is much more fearful, timid, a conformist and really understands her role as a woman.  And this is what comes out.

 

Read-  Will you read the prologue with me….Who do you want to be?

 

Read pages 693-695

 

And we see that have set up the primary moral and political conflict- the most obvious thematic, although not the only and maybe not the most important- thematic problem of the text- the idea of higher law.  Garry from a political sense- what can you tell us about this.

 

Of course- it’s the basic problem of government that has plagued all of time and the conflict that we will never solve perfectly.  The idea of just government and what to do with an unjust government.  If the world is working in a good and peaceful and ideal way- the person in charge is going to make good laws that are fair and preserve a society that treats everyone equally- where the good people rise to the top and the bad people sink.  But, a society like this is impossible to pull off because of the exact problem Antigone is going to notice.  The people in charge do NOT always do the right thing.  They do NOT always act fairly, at least in your eyes; and they do NOT always act in the public good.  And this we are going to see illustrated in this verdict of Creon.  According to that culture, burying the dead was something that superceded human conflict.  You were subjected to the laws of mankind until you were dead, but after you were dead, you were NOT subjected to the laws of mankind.  So, in this case, this is what we have- Creon picked the side of Eteocles, the younger son- for whatever reason.  We really don’t know, at least not in this play, maybe the Greek scholars do, but in this play we don’t know if he was the better brother- if he had a reasonable reason for not giving up the throne- for Sophocles- and we can assume for the Greeks- that didn’t matter.  Whatever the reason, there was a war- men died- one side won- and their victory entailed all the spoils of war on earth…but not beyond that.  The other side of the grave was the jurisdiction of the gods.  You don’t get to interfere with what happened on that side of the grave.  The Greeks considered the burial of the dead one of their most sacred duties.  The psyche or spirit left the body upon death, and the burial traditions that surrounded the physical body amounted to respecting not just human dignity but respect for the gods who ruled both the underworld and the upper world.  In fact, if you saw a dead body on the side of the road, you were supposed to go over and throw a handful of dust on it= that was enough to pay respects to the spirit who’s body could not find rest without that as well as the gods.  In fact, they went so far as if you are at war- and if a general did NOT give the men even the enemies time to bury their dead- this was considered a capital offense.    Its also true, that women played a tremendously important role in burial.  They were chiefly responsible for all the aspects of the proper and very delineated rituals.

 

So basically, what you are saying, is that there is no conceivable way that what Creon did could be interpreted by any Greek as a reasonable law.

 

Absolutely not.  When he said that Polyneices body would not be buried, he was flying in the face of tradition, religion and even legal precedent.  This was an obvious case of personal anger and rage interfering with professional duties.  He was mad at Polyneices, he was not regent, and he was going to use his temporal authority to punish Polyneices after death- and this may I say is obviously offensive to the gods.  No way around it. 

 

And let me point out that Creion has been king of all of five minutes.  Eteocles had been ruler.  Creon was only the regent until the boys were of age.  And let me say that most myths will tell you that Polyneices had a son, so Creon was never going to be king long term, even after Polyneices death- the most he could be was regent again until Polyneices son grew up.  So, here’s the conflict- Antigone wants to go over Creon’s head- she’s going to appeal to what we now call higher law.  She’s going to make the moral assessment that man’s law is not the final moral authority.  God’s law is the higher moral authority and in those moments when Gods law and mans law conflict, I have not only the right but the moral obligation to ignore man’s law.

 

That’s it exactly, and that’s a conversation we’ve had in our own modern political context.  Dr. king made the case more eloquently than almost any one in the letter he famously wrote from the Birmingham jail.  He says, “There are two types of laws: just and unjust.  I would be the first to advocate obeying just laws.  One has not only a legal but a moral responsibility to obey just laws. Conversely, one has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws.”  He quotes St. Augustine so far as to say that “An unjust law is no law at all.”  And of course he goes on to eloquently give various examples from all times in history reminding his readers that, “Everything Adolph Hitler did in Germany was legal and everything the Hungarian Freedom fighters did in Hungary was illegal.  It was illegal to aid and comfort a Jew in hitler’s Germany, and then he says, “even so, I am sure that had I lived in germany at that time, I would have aided and comforted my Jewish brothers.”

 

Funny you should bring up Hitler, there was this guy named Jean Anouiilh who lived in France during the occupation of France by the Nazis.  During the way, he presented his own version of Antigone.  It’s actually a very cool. Movie and you can see it on Youtube.  All the charactesr wore modern military uniforms, they all smoked cigarettes, they were modern clothes and carried guns.  However, the point of the play was to be subversive.  He was trying to call out those people in France who were collaborasting with the nazis on the grounds that it was the legal thing to do.   After the war in 1949, it premiered in London and Lawrence Olivier played the Chorus, which was actually the name of the narrator, and vivien Leigh (like from Gone with the Wind) played Antigone.  It’s truly very cool.   I actually like it much better, if I have to be honest.

 

And there is the age-old conflict.  What do I do?  It’s awful to be in the position of the Hungarian freedom fighter, of the French citizen in Nazi controlled Germany or in this case, the sister of the man the ruler told not to bury on pains of death.  So what do you do?  Especially if you promised your brother, you’d bury him. 

 

Well, for Ismene, there wasn’t a question.  She doenst even think about it.  She clearly says- what are you talking about, “We are only women’.  We’property- we don’t get to make decisions. We have no agency.  It’s not our responsibility.  Were off the hook by virtue of our sex and place in society.  And this is a reasonable position.  If I don’t get to decide anything, than it’s not my fault when things go poorly. 

 

But we see here, something that we saw in Oedipus as well- Sophocles, and I may say, the Greeks really admire those who take responsibility- even when they could arguable shirk it.  Antigone responds with- okay- do what you have to do. 

 

True- but I must say, there is a little bit here that seems not as altruistic as it might at first pass.  She is looking beyond death to the underworld, and basically appears to be thinking- we’re going to die eventually, and when we get down there- I may have to answer for some of this crap.  She even concludes by telling Ismene that the dead will be hating her- and she ends by saying this I am more afraid of death without honor than death at all…which is interesting and very Greek.  We don’t think like that anymore, but it’s a real thing.  I don’t want my memory to be dishonorable.  I don’t want my life after death to be dishonorable. 

 

After that emotional and heated exchange we are going to get the first choral ode or parados, if you’re interested in the Greek word for it.  And in this case, the chorus will be chanting these lines as they enter the stage.  The chorus talks about the war between the brothers, it sets the stage really, but ends with optimism- the war’s over- so lets have peace.  And on that ironic ode, remember, all the Greek plays are about some irony, Creon is going to come in with his decree.  He is the NEW king.  The battle is over.  And this is basically his very first decree.  He compares Thebes to a ship ( a metaphor you’ll recognize if you listened to the Oedipus podcasts, that play opened the same way).  Hes saying the ship has come to harbor and it’s ready for safety.  Then he’s going to talk about the need to have friendship and the need for loyality..and then…he puts his foot in his mouth, digs his own grave..pumupmpump…allows his hubris to get the best of him…if you want to think about it in Greek terms.  Read lines 35-50. (page 701)

 

I’m kind of glad you bring that word up, because one question I think reasonable people are going to have if they read this play and know anything about Greek theater is that it has to have a tragic hero- so who’s the tragic hero int his play and what is their tragic flaw?

 

Good question= obviously people do argue about that, but I’m just going to tell you my opinion and pretend it’s authoritative truth.  Antigone is the tragic hero, and I’ll defend my thinking on this next week, for starters- the title is named after her- but most importantly we have pathos for her- we feel fear and pity for her- we can identify with her- and if you remember, according to Aristotle, that’s what tragedy is going for.  We can fear that it could be us and we can pity that she doesn’t deserve what she gets.  Now that is not to say Creon is not tragic.  He definitely is.  But I don’t think he’s very heroic.  I don’t feel myself feeling all that bad for him when things go so so poorly for him at the end.  In some sense, you are led to feel..well, you had it coming, you dumb greedy arrogant son of a gun..what did you think was going to happen.  And being dumb is one of his big problems.  But I would also argue having a big ego is probably the larger and more lethal of the problems.  Why did he take it so personally that Polyneices attacked the city?  It wasn’t his kingdom?  Of courxe, he’d raised the boys, but it wasn’t his fight, really.  Was he mad that Polyneices didn’t fall in line like he wanted him to? I really don’t know, but this language seems very arrogant, and he seems arrogant in all of his lines during the entire play.

 

 Well, I know we can’t judge ancient dialogue by modern standards, and they were wearing masks and speaking loudly and concisely before large crowds, so there’s that dynamic, but his lines are aggressive.

 

They ARE aggressive, I think as well.  ‘This is my command”- and it’s going to get more so. 

 

When the sentry comes in, he’s scared out of his mind as he’s got to tell Creon something Creon doesn’t want to hear- and that is that somebody, although they don’t know who has buried Polyneices.

 

 He makes sure Creon knows it wasn’t him.  It’s a little funny.

 

I think so too, and I wonder if the sentry isn’t a little comic relief the audience since this play is sooooo heavy.  “the dead man- polyneices- out there- someone- new dust on the slimy flesh!’…someone has give it burial that way, and gone…. And we learn that Antigone didn’t dig a six foot hole and dump the body.  She just did some sort of ritual.  The sentry describes it as a ghosts peace.

 

Of course, this whole time Creon is getting angrier and angrier, and the sentry doesn’t notice until he totally explodes.  “STOP!” he calls him a doddering wreck.  He calls him crazy.  He says, “Is it your senile opinion that the gods love to honor bad men?”  Of course, I think that’s irony because the audience has to ask- who’s the bad man?  And then what I find strange, but not strange, is that Creon then seems to hijack Polyneices burial.  He brings up money and anarchy.  He makes the case that someone is bribing a guard to bury Polyneices.  Now, for the longest time, this made no sense to me- I kept asking myself- why would anyone bribe a guard to buy Polyneices?  The only person that would benefit from his burial is himself and he’s dead.  Then it occurred to me- Creon is paranoid- that’s his problem.  He’s been a king for one day and he’s already worried someone is going to come after him. 

 

It seems that even the dumb sentry is confused by all of this.  He even tries to make a comment to the king to the gist of- I don’t understand how this hurts you. 

 

To which Creon loses his mind again and runs him out.  The sentry runs out of the room and the last thing he says is “I am safe!” Meaning- hallelujah I got out of there with my head still attached to my body- or however ancient Greeks “shot the messanger” punpunpun to mix metaphors!!

 

Of course that will take us to the second choral ode- which is a nice place for us to end for the day.  In general choral odes are, of course, the chorus’ response to what has just happened.  And in this case, it’s a big enigmatic- the chorus talks about how amazing man is compared to other animals, but it ends with the observation that there are forces when it comes to man that really are unexplainable- fate seems to work both good and evil.  When the laws of the universe are kept, things go well, when they are not- things go awry.  Which leaves us with the question/. Who are they talking about Crewon or Antnigone- who is breaking the laws?  Only the audience is left to sort this out- because in dramatically ironic fashion- we’re the only ones that knows who’s doing what!!!

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