Matt Dawson meets Martin Johnson: 20 years on - a podcast by BBC Radio 5 live

Two of England's heroes from 2003, Matt Dawson and Martin Johnson, look back at their World Cup triumph 20 years on. In part one, they chart England's journey from quarter-finalists in 1999 to World Cup finalists four years later. But how much of their success was down to the players rather than the coaches? We hear why defeat in two Grand Slam deciders were just as important for their development as a famous victory over South Africa in Bloemfontein. And we hear all about their quarter-final battle with Wales, plus the semi-final victory over France and a very unhappy Olivier Magne.

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